3. The trainees do not displace regular employees, but work under close observation. (The company could afford to pay one intern or instead bring on 5 interns upaid to provide some sort of input to make profit on? Your stated scenario does not mathematically add up under the legally defined criterion.)

4. The employer that provides the training derives no immediate advantage from the activities of the trainees, and on occasion his operations may actually be impeded. (You are an unpaid intern however “treated as a full employee” which is precisely the reason this legislation was written for in the first place and why the Supreme Court ultimately weighed in on the matter.)

5. The trainees are not necessarily entitled to a job at the completion of the training period. (“It is 4 months long, with an opportunity to join the company at the end.” Was this truly an ‘opportunity’ as you purport or was this an introductory period to employment with the company?)

It seems as if companies run into a difficult situation with their labor costs and view ‘interns’ as a cost effective way to get labor inputs at little to no cost. If the latter is indeed the case then this is in violation of current law and is akin to indentured servitude (in this case an exchange of labor for a pittance, maybe, and questionable ‘experience’).

In my personal opinion, internships should be outlawed or at the very least the current laws should be properly enforced. If there was an outright boycott of internships by the labor force altogether the companies that offer these “opportunities” would be forced to legitimately hire personnel to further produce their product or service.

I have had many internships. How many? Six, all of which were unpaid. One of them was even a full time internship, 40 hours a week unpaid. Did I get a job at any of them? No. Did I get experience and make connections. Yes. However, in the long run isn’t an internship supposed to lead to getting a job somewhere? I hope so, but so far I haven’t seen any light of day. I find it to be slave labor at a certain point because I have worked so many hours unpaid and as a whole I find it absolutely ridiculous. Many of my internships did not allow me to do anything so unless I asked questions, I did not learn from them. I can’t blame the companies for not hiring me if no position is available, which is often the case. However, I don’t find it fair when so many employees say they paid their time and got in when I have to and have not got in anywhere. Many employees do not tell interns that not only they have to prove themselves, but they have to prove themselves over all the other interns that work there. It is a competition. The employees do not also tell interns that it can take a couple of years before they ever get hired after the internship ends. Most of my internships were after I graduated. I realize many people intern while they are in college, but eventually I would figure employees would let past interns know about jobs if you keep in touch. So far no one really has. Perhaps I have horrible luck, but from my experience it is more then just paying your dues. It’s more about getting lucky and being at the right place at the right time I feel.

On another note, there’s an interesting, brief video NY Creative Interns made that breaks the 6 requirements down for you. http://bit.ly/kfwPXE

call city hall and find out for yourself what your rights are as an intern. even if you sign any contracts, it is still illegal to hire someone for the company’s profit and not pay them what they are owed. New York State laws clearly say that. The place that I intern hasn’t paid me even the minimum wage (their employees definitely start at a higher rate than that). They can even go back 6 years to investigate a claim.

now the problem is, do I contact my company about this first? should I try to see what their reaction is to the fact that I am about to file for an investigation? or should I do it now while I am still interning there since the investigation process will take a while?

My goal there as an intern is to be there for 1 year so that I can have that on my resume, or get offered a part time job there. whichever comes first. I have enquired about working there more than once, and I have barely made the money back that I have spent travelling to my internship for the time that i’ve been there (metrocards are getting expensive).

so is there advice anybody can offer on the two options I have given myself to take action?

This is the saddest thing I have seen since David Copperfield sheepishly asked the work-house’s boss if he could “please have some more soup sir”. These poor students work hard to earn a degree, can not find a job due to the economy, but can find PLENTY of unpaid internships (so there really are jobs out there, just employees too cheap to pay for the value added!!!). I say haul all these employees in for tax evasion! This is modern day slavery of the worst sort!!

Architecture Intern (Playa Del Rey)
Date: 2010-08-19, 8:50AM PDT
Reply to: see below

Please read the entire posting before replying!

We are a small but fast growing firm located in Playa Del Rey. We specialize in high-end residential, high-end commercial, affordable housing and construction management.

We are currently looking for an architecture intern to assist architect on an almost daily basis. You don’t have to know everything about architecture, but you have to be passionate about architecture and are willing to learn. Since we do construction management, you will be learning a lot about construction. From time to time, you will be able to accompany the architect to the job site meetings and really see what goes on in real life. Our office is not a corporate environment and we are all very friendly and down-to-earth. We expect you to be the same.

Your job duties will include but not limited to:
-Assist Architect with emails
-Support staff when deadlines approach with necessary tasks (you should have a ‘all-can-do’ attitude)
-Organizing material library
-Some drafting and modeling and photoshopping
-Material boards
-Make coffee, running small errands

Please note that this is a non-paid internship, but we will sign off any school hours that you need. Also, depending on situation, you may be considered as a future employee if the firm grows bigger and we are growing even in this economy!

Please submit your resume with a cover letter telling us what you want to learn from this internship. Please also include on your cover letter a portrait of yourself. Please put “I am interested in the Position” in your subject line. If you are reading to this point, you are probably a potential candidate. No cover letter, no portrait, no subject line means no interview.

Please send required information to cwong(at)jsegandesign(dot)com. You can email me with questions, but be sure to put the appropriate info in the subject line! Please don?t attempt to call the office at all. Phone call means no interview. Everything will go through me and I am conducting the interview.

We are conducting interview the week of 13th of September, so this gives you plenty of time to put together your fabulous portfolio together.

As far as companies being immoral I don’t get that. Not all companies are immoral because they decide not to pay someone who is being trained to do a specific task.

Right now I’m in a position to hire employees as well as interns which we have paid, but unfortunately most of these interns do not know the job and need a lot of attention and nurturing which takes up a lot of time.

Just another point of view.

And we wonder why no one has money to spend in this economy – duh – if you are working for $0, you have nothing to spend!

Hustling (@ yyy: by the way, it’s not spelled “hussling”) by working a second job just covers up the problem. You’re all still training REAL employers to expect to pay you NOTHING.

Here’s a clue: you don’t have to take $0 to get experience – employers make a PROFIT from you, and pay you a share of that profit as pay – THAT’s a JOB. If they can’t figure out how to skim some profit from the result of your work – they FAIL as a business. THAT’S capitalism. The government knows employers will abuse free workers – that’s why there are laws to protect you – YOU need to file a complaint with the state to get your pay. YOU’RE PROTECTED – F’ING STAND UP AND USE IT, YO!

Lastly: LEARN to look for a job – it’s a SKILL, just like all the other classes you took. BUY a book and take a CLASS on it. STOP doing the lazy thing by getting the ‘rents to pay or working at BK – THE LAZY ROAD IS THE LOW ROAD, and we all know where that leads – downhill.

Working for free is a race to the bottom – longtime “Eternal interns”who can’t find paid work are discovering for themselves that it drags down everyone’s wage, because they are undercutting each other for $0. Not only that, but it’s gone on so long now, that employers are skipping hiring more experienced, PAID workers – with morons like you who work for nothing.

So don’t just blame the employers – YOU guys trained them to expect free help. It’s your own collective fault that you are now stuck in unpaid internship hell.

It’s a proven fact that the judgment sector of the brain does not mature until after age 24 – hence why you can’t rent a car until you’re 25. “Interns” who work for free are just another reflection of the storied lack of judgment in youth.

I will have to create an agreement (with our system legal)to employers who offer “unpaid internships” to our students and to remind them that they must meet all 6 of the following statements about the intern’s time with the company.

Also, I find it laughable that people think the students taking these internships are the ones that can afford to “work with no pay” I’ve done unpaid internships, and could not work without pay. How did I do it. Hussling. It was a miserable time, but I don’t think I’ve ever learned about life as much as I did during that miserable time. I worked in DC (world capital of unpaid internships), bartended, and snuck out during lunch to sneak into political lectures where they provided free lunch. I handed out flyers in the mornings before going to work. I collected furniture from craigslist and collected professional clothes from friends.

I really don’t recommend unpaid internships if you have a GREAT, PAID job, but if you don’t have one, an unpaid internship is a way to play the game. It’s not a great game, and I didn’t make up the rules, so following the rules doesn’t make those who take unpaid internships idiots – it means they are realistic about their worth on the market. And let’s face it, the market does not give a flying ()*() about the internal worth of human beings.

I have a post on the specific subject: http://maggiestewart.weebly.com/1/post/2010/03/the-reality-of-an-unpaid-internship.html

But I’m pretty sure being required to go to my employer’s home to organize his CDs is not legal, whether he’s paying me or not (which he’s not).

It is a great experience where you are treated as a full employee, and you learn a lot! Obviously, the 4 months suck, especially the factor on you wonder if they will switch you over to becoming paid or not.

However, what I’ve heard is that the company, due to some limited funds at the time for the summer had two options.

1) Have one intern be fully paid
2) Have 5 interns under the 4 month unpaid scheme. That allowed the company to continue making money, while also ensuring that those that were not taking the internship seriously were weeded out after 4 months.

It’s not the best deal, but since it was a great learning experience, I thought it was worth it. I just had to be careful with money for those first 4 months.

On top of this, many people find it hard to find quality internships due to their geographic area, their colleges not offering them, etc.

The debate will always go on as to whether unpaid internships are fair or not. I would venture to say that they are unfair – if you are doing menial tasks that do not provide any quality to either your education or to your resume. But, if you are really performing tasks that WILL add juice to your resume and go a long way in future employers eyes when they see it on your resume – wouldn’t you consider that fair? Especially if they are short, and you have your pick of which ones you apply for!